Question regarding export of failed MOT car

[JAC]

I am not sure where this would go, or even if any of you can actually help with this, but I am sort of thinking out loud here.

As I am still waiting to get my car running properly again, I am putting together a list of tasks that I plan on addressing over the next 6 months or so.

One of the things on this list is a set of wheels, as I would like some multispoke wheels that I will problably paint black, and want to keep the original wheels in case I want to go back to standard. I am looking for something along the lines of the FRP wheels, but either in 15" or 16" max.

Anyways, the prices I am finding around here are around 300€ to 500€ for the wheels.

I would also like to get a new interior for the Puma, as I wan't to do some personal modifications, but wan't to keep the original as is (it's in great shape). For an interior here from a scrap yard, it is another 300€ or more.

So, this got me thinking... (which is always dangerous )

I know from past experience that I can get a car shipped down from the UK for around 500€, door to door, which is about the price of the wheels.

If I could find a car that has (or is about to) fail the MOT due to rust (either on the arches or the chassis), then these seem to sell pretty cheap in the UK. I have seen a few around for the price of just the dash here! I could get the car shipped down here, strip off all the useful parts and scrap the chassis and anything else that is not useful.

So, I am thinking that if I can find a car that is selling cheap, with some wheels on it that I like, that would aready be most of the investment covered, the rest of the parts would be nearly free. If I could find a cheap Millennium, that would be a jackpot just for the seats

This brings me to my question...

If I was planning on buying a running car, I would fly to the UK, find one I like, buy it, arrange shipping and fly back. Obviously that wouldn't work in this case, as it would be cost prohibitive. Also, I found out recently (when thinking of getting an MR2 or an Elise shipped down) that you now need a UK address to be able to buy a car, to change the paperwork into your own name before exporting.

Does anyone know what the score is with a car that is to be scrapped?

In Spain, you can only change the cars paperwork over with a valid MOT, if not, then it has to be taken to a scrap yard to get a certificate that it has been scrapped (which makes buying a car here for parts nearly impossible). Is this the case in the UK also?

I know this is a bit of a weird subject, but any info you can give me, or any direction you can point me in would be greatly appreciated.

(BTW, this is not a rush, I would problably plan on doing this next spring/early summer).

Thank you all, as always!

 

[Ian G]

The most sensible way to do this would be to buy a road-worthy car that's currently MOT'd, taxed and insured in the UK. If you could obtain insurance cover for you to drive then it would be perfectly legal to borrow it to drive to Spain, if you decide to buy it while its over there and strip/scrap it straight away then that's up to you. I'm not sure of any law or condition of ownership which would prevent purchase after its already temporarily exported. Never done it but I can't see that its necessary for the car to come back in order for the sale to proceed.

I know some day insure companies insist that the journey starts and ends in the UK so that may not work.

Also not sure if you can be a named driver while not residing in the UK although can't recall ever needing to give a postal address for anyone I've named, normally just name, DOB and licence history is enough. Plus in that case you'd need someone willing to name you who could handle you crashing on the way home and the subsequent effect that will have on their insurance.

 

[mihalyn90]

Well as i see the guys from here (Romania), they just go, grab a car, and drive it here from Germany. They make all the sell/buy contract etc in one day... here is another question of putting it on the road... but still...

Regarding the scrap, here in Romania, to erase the car from the road, you can go to a scrapyard, leave the car and get a paper that says you left the car there... or just put it in your garage, and make a request to be erased from circulation... simple as that... here on the internet there are a lot of people just erasing the car and selling it on pieces

I don't know about the UK... they are driving on the wrong side of the road... well anyway, this is Romania, and i saw some RHD cars with Romanian numbers here, running completely legal... don't ask how the hell...

 

[Ian G]

Yeah you can advise the DVLA in the UK that the car is scrapped just by writing them a letter.

There is a more official route known as a Certificate of Destruction but its not enforced and there's no penalty for not having obtained one.

 

[JAC]

The most sensible way to do this would be to buy a road-worthy car that's currently MOT'd, taxed and insured in the UK. If you could obtain insurance cover for you to drive then it would be perfectly legal to borrow it to drive to Spain, if you decide to buy it while its over there and strip/scrap it straight away then that's up to you. I'm not sure of any law or condition of ownership which would prevent purchase after its already temporarily exported. Never done it but I can't see that its necessary for the car to come back in order for the sale to proceed.

I know some day insure companies insist that the journey starts and ends in the UK so that may not work.

Also not sure if you can be a named driver while not residing in the UK although can't recall ever needing to give a postal address for anyone I've named, normally just name, DOB and licence history is enough. Plus in that case you'd need someone willing to name you who could handle you crashing on the way home and the subsequent effect that will have on their insurance.

Unfortunately, it works out more expensive to drive the car down than to ship it, then I would also have to add the cost of travelling to the UK.

Also, it would put someone in the situation where they would need their insurance to cover me for the 1500km trip, which I would prefer not to put someone in that situation.

I could get the car transferred into a family members name (I have family in the UK), but again, that would add to the cost, and would also involve a 3rd party.

I was thinking more of just a private purchase contract/receipt, and getting the car thrown on the back of a lorry.

 

[JAC]

Well as i see the guys from here (Romania), they just go, grab a car, and drive it here from Germany. They make all the sell/buy contract etc in one day... here is another question of putting it on the road... but still...

Regarding the scrap, here in Romania, to erase the car from the road, you can go to a scrapyard, leave the car and get a paper that says you left the car there... or just put it in your garage, and make a request to be erased from circulation... simple as that... here on the internet there are a lot of people just erasing the car and selling it on pieces

I don't know about the UK... they are driving on the wrong side of the road... well anyway, this is Romania, and i saw some RHD cars with Romanian numbers here, running completely legal... don't ask how the hell...

I have done this plenty of times, just going and buying a car from somewhere, getting private temporary plates (which include the insurance for 15 days) drive it back and import it.

The issue here is that I would rather not go through the hassle and cost of all this.

To give you an approximate example of bringing one from Germany:

Flight to Germany: 250€
2 nights in Germany: 200€
Other costs in Germany (taxi etc.): 50€
Temporary plates & Insurance: 100€
Fuel to drive car back: 100€ (driving slowly with a car that runs well )
Tolls through France: 150€
MOT in Spain (to allow change of name and registration): 150€
Registration in Spain: 850€
New plates: 30€
Declare car as no longer in circulation: 80€

So that is nearly 2000€ plus the price of the car. I only paid 1900€ for mine

 

[JAC]

Yeah you can advise the DVLA in the UK that the car is scrapped just by writing them a letter.

There is a more official route known as a Certificate of Destruction but its not enforced and there's no penalty for not having obtained one.

The letter to the DVLA is the thing I was uncertain about. So you don't actually need to present the car anywhere to get it declared as scrap?

Another option is to take the car a part and just ship all the parts, but it would work out more expensive than the whole car. It costs 200€ per pallet to ship from the UK to here, and I doubt I could fit all of it on 3 pallets.


Anyways, as I said, this is something that I will continue to look into over the next few months.

Thank you both for your input.

 

[Ian G]

The other issue not yet considered is that if you get one car the bits might not all be OK.

I know when I'm supplying stuff particularly bulk orders the parts can come from many cars as they will each have bits which are OK and bits which are not.

 

[JAC]

That is a very good point, and one that I also have to factor in.

If I can find one with decent wheels and a decent interior, then the rest should be a bonus, but as you say, I need to add up what I really need to get out of the deal.

I have found a couple of Pumas here in bad shape for around £1000, if I deduct £500 for expenses, I am hoping I could get something semi decent in the UK for £500 (considering I don't care about rust in the chassis or body).

 

[PaulQ]

The way would seem to be simple enough.

You will need to buy the car and tell the owner to arrange for it to be taken to the docks for outward shipping. If it had no MOT, it would have to be transported. If it has an MOT and is taxed and insured, no matter how short, then it could be driven.

In both cases you would have to pay the owner to arrange the transport/ take it to the docks and pay for him to get back to his home.

This site https://www.gov.uk/taking-vehicles-out-of-uk/for-12-months-or-more" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; tells you what you need. Note that this depends on what the Romanian government need. If you can simply appear at an office and say, “This is mine, please register it in my name.” then you will not need anything. However, it is likely that you will need proof of ownership, and, in the UK that would be the V5C form. This form should be acceptable in Romania.

There is a section on the V5 (the car’s registration document) that relates to cars that are permanently exported.

The alternative is to do nothing until you receive the car:

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/414961/V756_260215.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Although it is useful to have a UK address, as the documents registering you as the keeper/owner will be sent there, it is not essential

 

[JAC]

Hi PaulQ, thanks for the input.

However, I think there is a little confusion as to what the final goal of this is.

Just to clarify, I am not in Romania, I am in Spain. Unfortunately here they do ask for all kinds of paperwork and processes, and most importantly money, which by the end of the day puts the price of the car up to around the same price as a car here.

In this case, I have no intention of driving the car, only breaking it down for parts.

The ideal plan would be:

- Find a car that has decent wheels, interior and if possible engine, but has rusted to the point of not passing the MOT (making it cheap).

- Buy the car via internet or, depending on where in the UK it is, send a friend/family member to see/buy the car.

- Owner sends letter to DVLA to say that the car is being broken down to be sold for parts.

- Owner issues me a private sales contract stating that the car is being sold to me for parts only (which serves as proof that I am not stealing the car).

- I send a lorry/trailer to the owners house to pick up the car.

- Car travels to me in Spain on lorry/trailer.

- I receive car and remove all the parts that I am interested in.

- The remaining unuseable parts and chassis get taken to a local scrap yard and crushed.


This would be my ideal plan, but I am not sure what paperwork/issues the owner would have with this in the UK. If it is possible for him to just declare the car as scrap and issue a private sales contract, great, if not, that is where the issues start

 

[Ian G]

You can't tell the DVLA you've scrapped it unless you personally did it.

 

[PaulQ]

Having read your last message, I suggest that you do exactly as you intend (particularly that part where you have a letter from the owner - including his name, address and telephone number - stating that the car is now yours - and don't forget to obtain the V5 registration certificate.) You have no intention of registering the car in Spain, so you have, in fact done no more than moved some parts within the EU (the fact that they are bolted on a car is irrelevant.)

As a courtesy to the British registration authorities, you might like to send them a note saying that the car has been permanently exported.