Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

General discussion area relating to the Ford Puma, any off topic or threads that are deemed chat/waffle will be moved to the relevant areas! Please keep ON TOPIC at all times.

Moderator: Moderators

Post Reply
User avatar
YOG
Guru!
Guru!
Posts: 2325
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:38 pm
Model: Thunder
Location: West Sussex

Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by YOG » Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:19 pm

The following is reproduced by kind permission of Citroen Car Club (CCC).

Two main points to note:
1. The Puma has a metal fuel tank.
2. Although it says "can damage cars registered before 2000", the Puma remained basically the same throughout production.

249

Sans Plomb 95-EIO

I expect most of you have already been aware of the 95-E10 biofuel addition to pumps in France, but I have to date had 14 e-mails from members asking for clarification. The petrol called '95-E10' is a mixture of regular unleaded fuel and ethanol. It is suitable for new cars, but can damage vehicles registered before the year 2000, motoring bodies have warned. The biofuel sits alongside the commonly used and similarly named unleaded Euro 95 in many garages across France and while a public awareness campaign in the country has avoided confusion amongst the French, British holidaymakers face the prospect of unwittingly picking the wrong pump. Motoring associations, including the RAC, warned those preparing to travel to France to be aware of the biofuel which is 90 per cent regular unleaded and 10 per cent ethanol.

Ethanol is highly corrosive and can wear away the metal fuel tanks common in cars registered before 2000, leading to leaks. Most new cars have plastic tanks and are therefore not affected by corrosion. The E10, which has been gradually distributed across stations in France since 1 April and which the French government has admitted is incompatible with 40 per cent of vehicles on the road, can damage engines of cars registered before the year 2000, according to Holland's national automobile association, the ANWB. Almost one third of cars on the roads in the UK today were registered before 2000. According to the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders there are 9,579,000 cars out of 31,105,988 which pre-date the year 2000.

Filling up just a few tanks of the new biofuel may not lead to serious problems with pipes and connectors but regular use could leave long-lasting damage. A spokeswoman for the RAC said: "There is some concern that some, particularly older vehicles, might have problems - particularly materials compatibility i.e. flexible hoses leaking. If drivers can confuse diesel and petrol at the pumps, as they often do, then they could just as easily confuse ordinary unleaded with unleaded containing 10 per cent ethanol in France, so be more aware as to what is written on the pump. It is always clearly marked. Look for any signage, such as E10, or the letters 'bio' to guide you in making a choice of which fuel to use. The petrol's introduction follows an EU directive relating to the quality of fuels which states that all petrol must include between 5 and 10 per cent of ethanol by 2013.

When I use the various classics I have, I always tend to use 98 fuel anyway, as I have found that even the normal 95 fuel in France doesn't help with smooth running and as yet this isn't affected. In my area particularly and so far where I have travelled of late, I have not had a problem finding the right fuel. It may just take a bit of diligence to make sure you are using the correct pump.
0 x
Rick

S/Steel BlueFlame Catback Exhaust. Denso Iridium Spark Plugs. ST150 Front Brakes. S/Steel Braided Brake Lines. Eibach Springs/KYB Shock Absorbers. Heated Washer Jets. Internal Boot Release. Glove Box Light. 2nd Boot Light. Diadem Side Repeaters. LEDs: Indicators, Parking, Stop/Tail, Number/Plate Lights. Bilt-Hamber Rust Treatment/Corrosion Protection.
Age itself is not an indicator of how fit a person is to drive.

User avatar
crystalpuma
Project Elder
Project Elder
Posts: 3441
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2007 9:15 pm
Model: Other
Location: Lincolnshire

Re: Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by crystalpuma » Tue Oct 13, 2009 9:44 pm

Thanks for the heads up :)
0 x
2985
Remember to always be cheery :D
Nancy's project thread

User avatar
DradusContact
Guru!
Guru!
Posts: 2470
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 9:11 pm
Model: Thunder

Re: Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by DradusContact » Wed Oct 14, 2009 9:31 am

Useful info for sure. Didnt know modern cars had plastic tanks though, dont like the sound of that!
0 x

User avatar
Dal
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 14769
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2007 8:27 pm
Model: Other

Re: Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by Dal » Wed Oct 14, 2009 9:37 am

Less chance of a potentially dangerous spark from a plastic tank I'd have thought.
0 x

User avatar
DradusContact
Guru!
Guru!
Posts: 2470
Joined: Mon Mar 10, 2008 9:11 pm
Model: Thunder

Re: Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by DradusContact » Wed Oct 14, 2009 9:49 am

But surely its not as strong, and goes brittle with age/cold etc? We used to have those plastic garden chairs in the hotel where i used to work, the first time someone sat on them after the winter they had got so brittle over the winter they just collapsed. The guy sued the hotel too incidently.
0 x

User avatar
YOG
Guru!
Guru!
Posts: 2325
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:38 pm
Model: Thunder
Location: West Sussex

Re: Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by YOG » Wed Oct 14, 2009 12:38 pm

There's plastic and then there's plastic! Also, the tank being underneath the car does not get exposed to UV/Sunlight. My old Citroen Xantia had a plastic tank, you'll be suprised what cars already do.
0 x
Rick

S/Steel BlueFlame Catback Exhaust. Denso Iridium Spark Plugs. ST150 Front Brakes. S/Steel Braided Brake Lines. Eibach Springs/KYB Shock Absorbers. Heated Washer Jets. Internal Boot Release. Glove Box Light. 2nd Boot Light. Diadem Side Repeaters. LEDs: Indicators, Parking, Stop/Tail, Number/Plate Lights. Bilt-Hamber Rust Treatment/Corrosion Protection.
Age itself is not an indicator of how fit a person is to drive.

User avatar
yippeekiay
Project Elder
Project Elder
Posts: 6219
Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2009 7:36 am
Model: Other
Location: Up North i.e. 100+ Miles Above Manchester!!!

Re: Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by yippeekiay » Thu Oct 15, 2009 1:23 am

Yeah, my Omega had a plastic petrol tank too. (and a freakin huge metal LPG cylinder in the boot..lol)
0 x
584858495850PUMAImageRX8Image
Meet(s) Attended:- 2008;- Dec-Gateshead 2009;- Jan-Yorks' D, Mar-Leic', Apr-Derby D/Alton T, May-FITP, Jun-Chats', Jul/Aug-Euro Tour, Aug-Hi Force 2010;- May-Nurb'. Aug-FF. Sep-NE Mini Meet 2011;- Feb-Martin B'day, Apr-Nurb1', May-POD(WON), May-FITP, Jun-Nurb2', Aug-FF, Sep-Sheffield, Nov-Stafford(RX) 2012;- Sep-Sheffield 2013;- Mar-Rockingham Next Meet(s):- 2013;- ?????

User avatar
n1ck1984
Project Regular
Project Regular
Posts: 212
Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2009 3:50 am
Model: 1.4
Location: Stirling
Contact:

Re: Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by n1ck1984 » Wed Oct 28, 2009 2:07 pm

My old man used to work in a place where they Produced the chemicals for plastic making detail. and just like YOG said, theres plastic then theres plastic! i don't think for one second that its '' made in china '' kinda gear. Not that theres anything wrong with china's plastic...........i'll shurrup! :P
0 x
Veni, vidi, vici.

John Woodward
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:02 am
Model: Other

Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by John Woodward » Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:14 am

Sorry to revive an old thread, but I understand that E10 petrol is going to happen in the UK in the not too distant future. I'm intending to purchase a 1.7 hopefully in the next few months and wondering if there is anything that can be done to reduce the risk of potential problems with E10 petrol. I've heard of E5 petrol dissolving old fuel hoses on older vehicle's.
I've just sold my classic Mini !275 and had already replaced all the "rubber" fuel pipes with ones rated as being suitable for E10.
0 x

User avatar
YOG
Guru!
Guru!
Posts: 2325
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 11:38 pm
Model: Thunder
Location: West Sussex

Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by YOG » Fri Nov 06, 2020 11:44 am

The Government is proposing to introduce E10 petrol as the 95 octane “Premium” grade, whilst intending to keep E5 petrol available in "Super" grade. So, if you want to ensure the petrol you use in your Puma is "OK", switch to the more expensive "Super", once (or before) E10 becomes available. I've always run mine on "Super", as I don't do many miles annually.
https://www.gov.uk/government/consultat ... e10-petrol
0 x
Rick

S/Steel BlueFlame Catback Exhaust. Denso Iridium Spark Plugs. ST150 Front Brakes. S/Steel Braided Brake Lines. Eibach Springs/KYB Shock Absorbers. Heated Washer Jets. Internal Boot Release. Glove Box Light. 2nd Boot Light. Diadem Side Repeaters. LEDs: Indicators, Parking, Stop/Tail, Number/Plate Lights. Bilt-Hamber Rust Treatment/Corrosion Protection.
Age itself is not an indicator of how fit a person is to drive.

John Woodward
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:02 am
Model: Other

Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by John Woodward » Fri Nov 06, 2020 11:00 pm

I agree about using "Super unleaded", but eventually E10 "Super" will be difficult to find, remember how LRP was supposed to continue for older cars, but after a couple of years it disappeared off the forecourts. Maybe somebody has or will develop an Ethanol proof liner for fuel tanks.
0 x

User avatar
Dal
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 14769
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2007 8:27 pm
Model: Other

Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by Dal » Sun Nov 08, 2020 6:40 pm

John Woodward wrote:
Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:14 am
Sorry to revive an old thread, but I understand that E10 petrol is going to happen in the UK in the not too distant future. I'm intending to purchase a 1.7 hopefully in the next few months and wondering if there is anything that can be done to reduce the risk of potential problems with E10 petrol. I've heard of E5 petrol dissolving old fuel hoses on older vehicle's.
I've just sold my classic Mini !275 and had already replaced all the "rubber" fuel pipes with ones rated as being suitable for E10.
11 year thread resurrection - top work!!

Tesco Momentum 99 has been using 5% ethanol for years FWIW
0 x

John Woodward
Newbie
Newbie
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2020 9:02 am
Model: Other

Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by John Woodward » Sun Nov 08, 2020 11:05 pm

Sorry, didn't want to start a new thread. I did apologise for resurrecting an old thread, but as a potential owner I've read an enormous amount of old posts on this forum and I am genuinely concerned about the impact of E10.
I understand that BP super unleaded does not normally contain any Ethanol at present, one of our local car club members, buys 2 litres, takes it home and tests it for Ethanol, if its OK, he goes back and fills up his old Morgan, having experienced a multitude of fuel related problems caused by ethanol in fuel. FWIW I've not yet seen any fuel labelled as E10, don't have a Tesco's near me !
2 x
2001 Puma Lux pack 1.7 Medium Steel Blue

User avatar
red
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 11323
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2007 4:31 pm
Model: Other
Location: Cambridgeshire
Contact:

Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by red » Mon Nov 09, 2020 12:15 pm

It's no problem resurrecting threads here when it's relevant conversation 8-)

In fact it's part of the beauty of a forum.
1 x
FRP#0201 (2000) 2009-2011
Melina Blue (1999) 2006-2009
Moondust Silver (2000) 2006

mmc757
Adolescent
Adolescent
Posts: 114
Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2019 6:17 pm
Model: Other
Location: Right behind you

Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by mmc757 » Mon Nov 09, 2020 2:17 pm

How long is the UK going to allow you to keep driving combustion engines?
0 x
Cougar nut, wanting a Puma to match the Cougars, waiting out the absurd 25 year import limit for the USA
Semper Purrisimo

1961ed1961
Adolescent
Adolescent
Posts: 43
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 8:53 pm
Model: 1.7

Future Petrol, (Already In France) Warning

Post by 1961ed1961 » Fri Nov 13, 2020 1:54 pm

If you recall a number of years back tesco fuel sparked a debate (no pun intended) when people began to complain about engines running roughly or in some cases not at all , it later came to light that it was down to the ethanol content in the fuel, as for plastic fuel tanks statistically there proven to be safer than steel , the material used is a polypropylene mixed with other materials, thanks to Yog for the information on this subject I have to confess I don’t pay enough attention at the pumps but will do in future.
0 x

Post Reply

Return to “Puma Area”