The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Do you have a Puma that is a project? Do you want to track the progress with your own thread? Feel free to do it here.

Moderator: Moderators

User avatar
Frank
Project Petrol Head!
Project Petrol Head!
Posts: 869
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2013 6:14 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: East Sussex

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby Frank » Sun Feb 19, 2017 12:36 am

g-whizz wrote:Source of the post It's also had new links & 'bones, though I must confess, I didn't do 'em :shock: this was down to my jack playing up

Ah, the old 'My jack was playing up' excuse, eh?

This stuff is not 'all or nothing', no one feels 'guilty' if they don't fix their own PC, they just do what they can or turn the job over right from the start. Same with cars.

Most people are also more capable than they think they are and the proof lies in just the sheer number on non-professionally trained cooks who never actually starve to death and somehow manage to feed themselves.

As I wrote, it doesn't have to be 'all or nothing' and I'm glad that threads like this exist in a car forum. My advice is to research well and then have a go. A lot of this stuff is really not that hard, but just be aware that some is. Learn to know the difference and you're good to go. :-)

Plus, with the coming of the Internet, this stuff is easier these days. Here is what most Main Dealer Parts Departments in London and South East England were like prior to the Internet - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HoPXQ9fotZM

(seriously, some of those places were truly bizarre and I've seen parts guys dragged over the counters and whacked, when they did it to the wrong guy, and all sorts, back in the day. It was like something out of a Wild West saloon!)
1 x

g-whizz
Project Regular
Project Regular
Posts: 285
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:20 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: Southport

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby g-whizz » Sun Feb 19, 2017 1:51 pm

I confess to a tiny shred of guilt but mainly to a big slice of smile at getting the links & 'bones done (& my front wheels balanced) for £25 :grin: I was quite happy to have a crack at it but with the MOT pressing & my jack not following suit I figured this was one of those "discretion is the..." moments.

...(Not so) Funnily enough, I am also about to tackle my PC as Win10 has crashed after trying to reactivate Kaspersky, won't even accept a standard reboot with the media creation tool so my only hope now is a custom reboot with a partition otherwise it's a factory reset of the laptop and total loss of documents, images and all data bar the original OS (Win7) :evil: ...Not everything it seems is better since t'internet :-)
Last edited by g-whizz on Mon Feb 27, 2017 12:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
0 x
My goals are world peace, and a piece of the world... if my plans for a benevolent dictatorship ever come together.

At the moment though am too busy with this: viewtopic.php?t=29348

User avatar
Frank
Project Petrol Head!
Project Petrol Head!
Posts: 869
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2013 6:14 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: East Sussex

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby Frank » Sun Feb 19, 2017 2:52 pm

g-whizz wrote:Source of the post ...(Not so) Funnily enough, I am also about to tackle my PC as Win10 has crashed

Sorry, I should have made that part clearer, I was comparing the hardware side, not software :-) i.e. why do people not feel bad about not fixing one type of machine, but often do about a different type of machine.


g-whizz wrote:Source of the post otherwise it's a factory reset of the laptop and total loss of documents, images and all data bar the original OS (Win7) :evil:

You can avoid that possibility of data loss if you put a small Linux distro (operating system) on a flashdrive, boot into that and grab all the personal stuff off the Windows OS partition and save it to flashdrive or external hdd/ssd. In other words, the Linux Operating System will give you access to the information stored on the Windows OS (the only exception is if Windows was hibernated, not shutdown before it blew up) This is a good automated tool for that - https://unetbootin.github.io/ and pick a simple Linux distro, like Puppy. Once you've done the flashdrive, you got it forever and never have to worry about data loss on Windows ever again. Hope that helps.

Linux stuff is pretty good and is my main OS these days (on this PC, I 'quad boot' - choice of 3 different Linux OSs and 1 Windows OS on boot) I only know M$ up to Win7 though.
1 x

g-whizz
Project Regular
Project Regular
Posts: 285
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:20 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: Southport

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby g-whizz » Thu Apr 20, 2017 5:07 pm

Well, lately I've felt like a contestant on Strictly Dumb Dancing as it's been a case of one step forwards, two back, one forward.

You may remember I had a cambelt change that was something of a poor job and so needed re-timing by another mechanic? Well.....

On the front foot, I had a trip to Barnsley to pick up the leather rear seats (see photo in post from 09/02/17) and then over to Huddersfield to see Barry (and his lovely red Puma) and grab the rear bumper from his scrapper for a forthcoming project idea. Cheers for that mate.

All in all, it was a very pleasant trip, not even marred by the fact that Barry had promised Custards Creams but delivered Bourbons, you just can't trust anyone these days :lol:

Pleasant until the last 10 miles that was, when it soon became apparent that you really can't trust anyone these days as my engine started playing up again. With it repeatedly cutting out, I had to keep the revs high with the right foot, use the clutch with the left and the handbrake to slow at the lights and junctions; it was "fun".

So, on the back foot, out with the Forscan and yup, it's Bletchley Park in there: there was the P1381 code again (VCT overadvanced, bank A) only this time it was having a hut party with C1967 (RDO short circuit to ground, whatever that is) and B2261 (Parking lamp switch failure, which we're assuming is side lights?) It was that damn P code again though I was most concerned about. Comedy is apparently all about timing and cars must be very similar because when it's out, it just ain't funny.

On chatting to my mechanic mate it transpires that somehow (despite my informing him of the need for them) new stretch bolts were not used in the re-time. I despaired but at least it seemed we had a diagnosis.

Trying to get just the replacement bolts on their own though proved something of a stretch in itself. I was getting conflicting info from local Ford dealers (both in terms of part numbers and the nomenclature of the required bolts) while neither Dayco or Gates supply them separately. Eventually, after a bit of detective work, I managed to narrow it down. For future ref... the VCT pulley bolt is Ford 1126969 and the crankshaft bolt is 1057134.

My eyes widened though at the cost. The Ford dealer quoted me just over £15 for the VCT pulley bolt (on eBay they were just under £14) and just under a fiver for the crankshaft pulley bolt, which on eBay were double the price for one listing and £15 for the other. Maybe they should be called "stretching it" bolts?

My eyes positively popped out though when, after discovering a bit of wear around the bolt hole on the VCT pulley itself, I asked Ford how much a new pulley would cost.... a rather staggering £520 being the reply!!!
So a 2nd hand one at £42 from Ian G it was, cheers fella.

With all that done, car was re-timed and taken out for a test drive ... and the little b*gger did exactly the same thing again!! Another step back goes I. :evil:

My mechanic was rather stumped and I was something else rather more fruitily Anglo-Saxon... so in desperation, I put out a shout to the stout-hearted souls of Project Puma via "Help Me" and in an avalanche of indifference received exactly zero replies. I was now feeling sorry for myself.

Then, just as I railed against "The Gods" for their capricious nature; the Variable Control Timing* for being far too variable and not nearly controlled enough, and I was on the verge of abandoning all hope, there was a crack of thunder (I really need to change my ringtone) and then the voice of an angel come to deliver me from my torment... actually it was more of a baritone Yorkshireman as it was Barry on the phone, my hero! (He has long flowing locks just like Fabio too...honest!)

He reckoned that my mech' hadn't actually followed the correct procedure regarding the tensioner as outlined in the Gates tech bulletin. Now this would have been entirely feasible if not for the fact that I had specifically warned my mechanic about this rather specific procedure, and sent him the specific tech bulletin (twice) and also sent him a link to the very specific "How To Guide" with illustrated Ford TIS from PP's own pages...(all in all, I thought I'd been quite specific on this point) so surely Barry was, dare I say it, gulp, wrong?!

After chatting it through Barry kindly also agreed to speak to my mech' mate and at that point I learnt two valuable lessons...

1) When it comes to Puma cambelts, Barry is never wrong!
2) When it comes to mechanics, the saying "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink" might have been invented for them, if it hadn't already been invented for horses of course. Hmmm, how about "You can lead a mechanic to data but you can't make them think?" :wink:

That's really overly harsh to my mate to be fair, it's more that because they have done cambelts X times they think the Puma is just another job, and even if you tell them it isn't they can adopt that "yeah,yeah,yeah, I'll be fine" attitude... which eventually ends up with three attempts at re-timing someone else's poor cambelt change. Four attempts by two different mechanics should be a warning to anyone that the Puma needs more attention than most in this department.

My advice is: if you are going to tackle this yourself make sure you've got the skills and the specific tools and that you follow the Gates bulletin and Barry's wise words to the letter.
Cheers again for all your help on it mate. :ok:

If you can't take it on yourself then get a mechanic who's done Puma VCT's successfully before or, failing that, give him all the information and INSIST he reads & FULLY understands it (among other things, the correct pre-tensioning of the adjuster is critical) and preferably kidnap his family pet as insurance that the job is done correctly. Fido's tooth for a tooth jumped seems fair.

In the North West, there is at least one more mechanic who could now do it as he's had enough practice... though whether he'll ever want to see a Puma again after the amount of stick he's had over this is another question :lol:

So, hopefully, after another set of bolts, it's now one step forward again and my timing tango is complete... next up, a rumba with rust....

*Edit it's actually "Variable Camshaft Timing", maybe that was my problem all along? :?
Last edited by g-whizz on Sun Apr 23, 2017 12:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
2 x
My goals are world peace, and a piece of the world... if my plans for a benevolent dictatorship ever come together.

At the moment though am too busy with this: viewtopic.php?t=29348

User avatar
red
Site Administrator
Site Administrator
Posts: 10300
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2007 4:31 pm
Model: Other
Location: Cambridgeshire
Contact:

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby red » Thu Apr 20, 2017 6:13 pm

:grin: you make such a woeful story sound very amusing.

Odd you had no replies in the help section, usually someone chimes in, and I didn't even see it to be fair.

Fingers crossed it's all sorted and you've seen the back of that now :grin:
1 x
FRP#0201 (2000) 2009-2011
Melina Blue (1999) 2006-2009
Moondust Silver (2000) 2006

g-whizz
Project Regular
Project Regular
Posts: 285
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:20 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: Southport

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby g-whizz » Thu Apr 20, 2017 6:32 pm

red wrote:Source of the post :grin: you make such a woeful story sound very amusing.

Odd you had no replies in the help section, usually someone chimes in, and I didn't even see it to be fair.

Fingers crossed it's all sorted and you've seen the back of that now :grin:


Cheers & no worries Matt, only referenced it to reflect my pitiful state at the time... & make Barry look even more heroic :wink:
0 x
My goals are world peace, and a piece of the world... if my plans for a benevolent dictatorship ever come together.

At the moment though am too busy with this: viewtopic.php?t=29348

User avatar
tuonokid
Project Elder
Project Elder
Posts: 3279
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2012 8:41 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: Huddersfield

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby tuonokid » Thu Apr 20, 2017 8:40 pm

Awww thanks Greg and sos about the Bourbons but Fabio, really!!! More like Albert (Steptoe) :grin:
Barry
1 x
2001 ColOrado red Puma 1.7, work in progress.
Westfield SEIW 1800 Zetec.
Building Westfield SEI 2.0 Zetec Blacktop on TBs.
Fiesta Style 1.25
Aprilia Tuono Factory.
1975 Yamaha TY80
Now working on my sons Anglia 105e

My Project Link - viewtopic.php?f=64&t=23509

g-whizz
Project Regular
Project Regular
Posts: 285
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:20 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: Southport

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby g-whizz » Wed May 03, 2017 10:14 pm

Bah, da da da, da daaa da da da... "Tall and tan and young and lovely, the girl from Ipanema goes walking... "

Yup, it's time to ruuuumba with rust... the big question was would the ol' hips be what they once were? The Puma's not mine, mine are positively snakelike... as long as it's a python that's swallowed a goat we are talking about.

First off, it was out with the rear interior, rear seat removal details here if needed http://ford-puma.blogspot.co.uk/2015/09 ... -puma.html

So I could now check the rear of the floorplan...
ImageIMG_2699 by G Whizz, on Flickr
...so far so good

Then removing the rear interior panels, details here:
viewtopic.php?t=4110

The only things I'd add to that are to make clear where the three doorway clips are:
ImageIMG_2703 by G Whizz, on Flickr

and also where the other two of the three 8mm bolts mentioned are,
ImageIMG_2684 by G Whizz, on Flickr

Note there is also a boot light just to the right of them that needs unclipping (it's a twist fit) before you go moving the panel.

With that done and the fabric lining pulled back (the plastic cover to the rear seat latches just unclips with a bit of jiggling, it not you, and then you can pull the fabric over) I was still happy with what I found.

ImageIMG_2702 by G Whizz, on Flickr

ImageIMG_2689 by G Whizz, on Flickr

Next was removing those speaker boxes to get a good look at the arches from the inside. I didn't bother removing the T50 seat belt bolts mentioned in the guide above as it's not essential for this. There are three easy to spot bolts holding it at the top (10mm socket required) undo and pop it off the plastic locating lug at the bottom and out it pops.

The nearside, and things still looking good...outside
ImageIMG_2709 by G Whizz, on Flickr

and in:
ImageIMG_2708 by G Whizz, on Flickr

At this point I'm thinking of transitioning from rumba to samba because on the offside I've previously had the arch professionally repaired with a Puma Schneide panel... so my puma's hips looked as foxy as any Brazilian beach beauty...
ImageIMG_2698 by G Whizz, on Flickr

But on removing that driver's side speaker box it seems that the beauty is a little skin deep and the repair wasn't as professional as I'd been led to believe...
ImageIMG_2690 by G Whizz, on Flickr

It looks like they've just welded in the exterior arch panel without doing much about the bit of rust on the interior beneath, which is a bit like trying to add fresh milk to a soured pint. So, after a bit of a scrape to see what's what, looks like this needs sorting:
ImageIMG_2694 by G Whizz, on Flickr

Thinking a wire brush clean up, then trying Bilt Hamber gel to derust, then Vactan into the crevices (just in case the gel can't get in far enough) and then something like bondaprimer and then paint? Any other suggestions also welcome. :ok:
0 x
My goals are world peace, and a piece of the world... if my plans for a benevolent dictatorship ever come together.

At the moment though am too busy with this: viewtopic.php?t=29348

User avatar
Wild E. Coyote
Guru!
Guru!
Posts: 1974
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2011 9:47 am
Model: 1.7
Location: Croatia

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby Wild E. Coyote » Thu May 04, 2017 6:56 am

I am affraid that if you brush it hard enough, the rust will evaporate to nothing and you will see holes. That needs welding in the fresh material...
So sorry about bad news, don't kill the messanger
1 x

g-whizz
Project Regular
Project Regular
Posts: 285
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:20 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: Southport

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby g-whizz » Thu May 04, 2017 11:12 am

Wild E. Coyote wrote:Source of the post I am affraid that if you brush it hard enough, the rust will evaporate to nothing and you will see holes. That needs welding in the fresh material...
So sorry about bad news, don't kill the messanger


Hi Sinisa, thanks for the advice, no worries at all about shooting the messenger... though the "professional" repairman might be another story. Can't understand how you could weld the new panel in over that and think it is OK? :roll:

Not sure about how that area structured but given the limited scope of it and the fact it is interior, once properly cleaned up, would a decent glassfibre (cloth and resin not just filler) repair suffice? If so, at least I could do it myself and not be hoping someone else does it properly... and then finding they haven't. Also, if welded I assume that would affect the exterior panel too and it would then need a respray etc, so be basically paying for same job twice. Cheers, :ok:
0 x
My goals are world peace, and a piece of the world... if my plans for a benevolent dictatorship ever come together.

At the moment though am too busy with this: viewtopic.php?t=29348

User avatar
Frank
Project Petrol Head!
Project Petrol Head!
Posts: 869
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2013 6:14 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: East Sussex

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby Frank » Thu May 04, 2017 12:05 pm

g-whizz wrote:Source of the post Any other suggestions also welcome. :ok:

I'll keep this short, as I'm in a rush - use a plastic pipette to squirt the Vactan into the rear arch creases and at least 2inches up each inner/outer arch Don't forget to squirt into the rear part of the arch curve from the boot. Put a spot light where the speaker housing was and you can see in the boot where your hand and pipette need to go. Do 3 coats and allow each to dry.

If you do have any holes, then put the Vactan in a garden sprayer and 'atomise' it in there (I didn't need to do this.)

Finish the job with 2+ coats of Dinitrol Cavity Wax, again allowing each to dry otherwise you'll 'loosen' the previous coat and it might run down. Dry anything with a COLD fan blowing inside the car.

Finally, check your speakers for sun fade/splits (easy to repair if needed) and do the rear part of the sills while you're there. The sills have a 'membrane 'middle sill in there, so be sure to get both sides.

Was in that area a few weeks back and my arch stuff is looking as good as the day I did it 3 years ago.
1 x

g-whizz
Project Regular
Project Regular
Posts: 285
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:20 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: Southport

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby g-whizz » Thu May 04, 2017 8:08 pm

Frank wrote:Source of the post
g-whizz wrote:Source of the post Any other suggestions also welcome. :ok:

I'll keep this short, as I'm in a rush - use a plastic pipette to squirt the Vactan...
Was in that area a few weeks back and my arch stuff is looking as good as the day I did it 3 years ago.


Cheers Frank, :ok: looks like I need to sort it with new metal apparently...or maybe glassfibre mat if it's possible?
Will employ your method though after (and on the other side) as prevention.
0 x
My goals are world peace, and a piece of the world... if my plans for a benevolent dictatorship ever come together.

At the moment though am too busy with this: viewtopic.php?t=29348

User avatar
Frank
Project Petrol Head!
Project Petrol Head!
Posts: 869
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2013 6:14 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: East Sussex

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby Frank » Fri May 05, 2017 12:27 pm

g-whizz wrote:Source of the post looks like I need to sort it with new metal apparently..

Nope, relax, you don't have the problem you think you have. This is in a non-structural area (if it was structural then it must be welded, no if, no buts) and the original cause of the rust is known - viewtopic.php?p=338501#p338501. There's stuff about Vactan here - viewtopic.php?p=348767#p348767

This is a job you can do yourself - don't use that gel though, you want a thin rust convertor here, such as Vactan, that can get down right into that crease at a microscopic level, including into the original turned seam, if the welder's didn't remove it. Vactan is also a primer, which is why I suggested the extra coats. I'm not keen on slapping fibreglass over previously rusted areas with holes in them, as it is then well nigh impossible to keep an eye on the area in future. As any holes you have on that inner arch only require mechanical blocking to prevent moisture ingress from the outside, then I suggest you treat those areas from the outside with Vactan and follow up with something as simple as trowelling mastic and then put your arch liners back on. It will achieve what is needed, but leave the interior 'crease' available for future inspection. Then just finish the job with the cavity wax as outlined above.
1 x

g-whizz
Project Regular
Project Regular
Posts: 285
Joined: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:20 pm
Model: 1.7
Location: Southport

The "If I can do it, you can" thread...

Postby g-whizz » Fri May 05, 2017 8:29 pm

Frank wrote:Source of the post
Nope, relax, you don't have the problem you think you have... This is a job you can do yourself - don't use that gel though, you want a thin rust convertor here, such as Vactan... I'm not keen on slapping fibreglass over previously rusted areas with holes in them, as it is then well nigh impossible to keep an eye on... Then just finish the job with the cavity wax as outlined above.


Hi Frank, cheers for that, already got some Vactan as used it on something else so will get on with it. :ok:
0 x
My goals are world peace, and a piece of the world... if my plans for a benevolent dictatorship ever come together.

At the moment though am too busy with this: viewtopic.php?t=29348


Return to “ProjectPuma”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Majestic-12 [Bot] and 47 guests