Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Do you have a Puma that is a project? Do you want to track the progress with your own thread? Feel free to do it here.

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FastLee
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Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Post by FastLee » Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:04 am

Well.
This will be the thread for all the progress of my Puma 1.7. I Had other fun cars in the past but i wanted a Puma for a while.

Produced in October 1997 , License Plate from January 1998
65000 kms on the clock, from the 1st, 2nd, 3rd turn? Who knows. It feels like a 165000 km car by the way it sits. Probably that's the mileage.

Compared to the Puma prices over here it was really cheap.

The problems:
Blown Head Gasket
Missing interior light
Only has standard key, no Remote Key FOB
Parcel Shelf broken
Boot Struts are only decorative
Originally Cuirass Gray but the previous owner used Matte Gray Liquid Vinyl Paint on It.

Something to be removed in the future but first let's get it running and MOT'd

Some pics

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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

FastLee
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Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Post by FastLee » Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:09 am

I just took it for a half a mile drive here on the street to get a little feel of it. Will start the repairs asap.

Even with the blown head gasket the car seems to run smoothly. I suspect that the thermostat was removed to try to disguise the gasket failure in the past.

The brakes felt quite hard. Don't know if they are like that or not. But something to be checked. I Had several Peugeots 106 Rallye and a GTi and this brakes feel completely different.
The gearbox seems not to like quick shifting. It grinds slightly. Will replace the fluids later on to see if it gets better. Probably the sinchronizer rings already had better days.

Will post the progress over here :D
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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

SandStorm
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Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Post by SandStorm » Mon Dec 25, 2017 7:11 am

Welcome, conterrâneo!
Glad to have another Portuguese here xD aqui, no meio dos bifes, lol
Okay, first time I heard about a vct with blew up head gasket.
You really sure?
Common problems on these cars are usually the hcv valve that may cause overheating and blow only hot or cold. (válvula da sofagem)
Another usual problem is the valve rocker cover gasket that leaks. (junta da tampa das válvulas. Há de ver se não tem de rever o nível de óleo e se não tem o motor cagado atrás)

Be free to check my topic too
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Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Post by SandStorm » Mon Dec 25, 2017 7:13 am

Forgot to add: check the servo. Our cars from the first series have servo problems.
About the shifting, while mine shifts well, but slips clutch, yours may have problem in the pressure plate, not de clutching totally.
Better check that too, these cars like to eat clutch kits for breakfast.
If yours still the original, it's due a change. Is the grab point too high and the pedal hard to press?
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FastLee
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Post by FastLee » Mon Dec 25, 2017 2:32 pm

Hi there ;)

The oil filler cap has some mayo and the water expansion tank gets pressure. The car runs smooth but when it starts to heat there is a bit of steam out of the exhaust. I really suspect that there is no thermostat present but still didn't had chance to confirm that.
About the other issues will check that later. According to the last owner the clutch disk is new but have no info about the bearing and clutch press.
The rocker cover leaks. Checked that. But looking from the outside the head gasket also has some oil around it. It is noticeable just behind the intake manifold.

For our local prices the car was really cheap (less than a purple bill :D ) So there's some budget for repairs.
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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

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Xparty
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Post by Xparty » Mon Dec 25, 2017 11:06 pm

Vivas,

I saw the ad for that car and i also saw a bargain right there.
Good Luck :grin:
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SandStorm
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Post by SandStorm » Wed Dec 27, 2017 9:06 pm

Oh well, first case I'm hearing about.
I wonder how they managed that. Maybe they had a big failure like the hcv or loosing all coolant and didn't noticed it...
I just hope you find a trusty garage and that they will use good parts.
These cars are amazing
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FastLee
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Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Post by FastLee » Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:47 pm

Well ..

The trusty garage will be my garage. It just depends of my free time.
The goal is to take the car to a track day at Portimao later in next year so i think i will have enough time to fix it. :D
1 x
1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

FastLee
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Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Post by FastLee » Tue Jan 02, 2018 7:50 pm

Amazon is your friend  :D :D

Goodies arrived!

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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

FastLee
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Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Post by FastLee » Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:05 pm

Well. Finally i had some time to do something in the garage. wanted to test the car better, as i really did not spend much time with it.

Image

Top engine cover has a big leak. Typical as i read. Time for some cleaning.

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Then, first use of the cheap endoscopic camera. Not bad

Image

And a cold compression test

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Then. fitted the spark plugs. Started great. Left it running and just near the middle of the temp gauge i saw a little bit of steam out of the exhaust.

Hot temp compression test revealed cylinder 1 and 4 around 10 bar and 2 and 3 around 9 bar. The leakage is somewhere between them. Used the camera again and found some liquid on the 3rd cylinder ( oil or water )

Car runs great but the compression values look too low for what Audata says they should be (it says 12,4 bar. Really? Is this the expected? I think this number is too high, but not sure)

After this, i need to decide what to go for.
Changing piston rings etc etc i'm not in the mood for it. The piston rings themselves, as far as i know, cost almost what i paid for the car.
Head gasket, valve rotation, valve seals, will this restore some of the lost compression?

Or should i put some connections @UK to work and sort out a good 1.7 VCT engine...

Let's see...
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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

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Wild E. Coyote
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Post by Wild E. Coyote » Thu Jan 04, 2018 5:48 pm

The compression test value of 12,4 bar at starter speed (and warm engine) is correct.
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Post by alex' » Thu Jan 04, 2018 6:08 pm

Hello,

i have these compressions in my engine just after i buy it .... (engine have 142 000 km when i test it, and run fine)

Image
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Alex' from the french Puma forum : http://www.planetepuma.com/index.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Sorry for the possible spelling mistakes, I use google translator :-(

FastLee
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Post by FastLee » Thu Jan 04, 2018 6:18 pm

Wild E. Coyote wrote: The compression test value of 12,4 bar at starter speed (and warm engine) is correct.
Thank you for your reply.

So i presume that either piston rings or valves may be responsible for these lower results.
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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

FastLee
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Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Post by FastLee » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:13 pm

Well ...

Some progress is being made.

The engine is half way to get out.

Fiddling with some quite rusty bolts and a left side driveshaft that is stuck in the hub, but things are moving.

Hope to get this done in the next few days.
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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

FastLee
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Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Post by FastLee » Tue Jan 23, 2018 7:27 pm

So .. today was the day... engine out

Alone, checking every bolt location.

Fords are a bit diferent from PSA's.. those i already knew every bolt.

But it's out.

tomorrow probably i will put the engine in the stand to start stripping it out.

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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

FastLee
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Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Post by FastLee » Thu Jan 25, 2018 8:07 pm

Today the engine went to the stand.

And i started dismantling it.

Image

Hmmm ... mayonnaise... so good :lol: :lol:

Image
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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

FastLee
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Puma 1.7 VCT from Portugal

Post by FastLee » Sat Jan 27, 2018 3:39 pm

So. Cylinder Head is out

The head gasket is a Goetze, without markings. Will this still be the original? It's a german brand. Could be OEM supplier.

Visually it looks that there is a leak in the cylinder #3 and probably #2 both from the exhaust side.

Pictures below

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Image

The engine block has some wear. I notice it passing the finger in the top part of the cylinder. But no scratches on the walls.

To those that may know this better than me. Opinions?
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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

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Wild E. Coyote
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Post by Wild E. Coyote » Sat Jan 27, 2018 8:14 pm

Passing finger at top and feeling something is normal. That is the TDC area where piston stops and starts going down again. That will be the burned oil. Clean it with something soft (a rag!). Clean the bores but don't scratch them. Just use compressed air and some degreaser and then try again. From experience, nikasil bores are very hard and you should see the honing marks on them.
To be able to do that, you should dismantle the bottom end. Regarding the parts needed for the overhaul there are options, but not from Ford.
I would just warn you about the set of piston rings on ebay advertised as for puma. They are not for puma, but for honda accord A18 engine. The first compression ring on that set is Chromed and I had my doubts about it so I sent email to Mahle since they invented nikasil and here is their response C/P:

'Hello Mr. Tkalcevic,

thank you for your email and your interest for our MAHLE products.

In this case you could take any piston ring, but no ring with the coating: Chrom !
That mean - Nikasil is a very hard coating, so you could'nt use also any "hard - strong ring coating" !

Nevertheless for your Puma engine we have no information about piston -, liner - and ring material - coating.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Kind regards

Peter Gann
MAHLE Aftermarket GmbH
Product Management Engine Systems and Components (MDE)'

There is work around that setback explained on other threads on this forum.
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Frank
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Post by Frank » Sat Jan 27, 2018 10:07 pm

Wild E. Coyote wrote: That will be the burned oil. Clean it with something soft (a rag!).
Not an angle grinder then?
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Post by Frank » Sat Jan 27, 2018 10:07 pm

Wild E. Coyote wrote: That will be the burned oil. Clean it with something soft (a rag!).
Not an angle grinder then?
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Post by FastLee » Sat Jan 27, 2018 10:40 pm

Wild E. Coyote wrote:Passing finger at top and feeling something is normal. That is the TDC area where piston stops and starts going down again. That will be the burned oil. Clean it with something soft (a rag!). Clean the bores but don't scratch them. Just use compressed air and some degreaser and then try again. From experience, nikasil bores are very hard and you should see the honing marks on them.
To be able to do that, you should dismantle the bottom end. Regarding the parts needed for the overhaul there are options, but not from Ford.
I would just warn you about the set of piston rings on ebay advertised as for puma. They are not for puma, but for honda accord A18 engine. The first compression ring on that set is Chromed and I had my doubts about it so I sent email to Mahle since they invented nikasil and here is their response C/P:

'Hello Mr. Tkalcevic,

thank you for your email and your interest for our MAHLE products.

In this case you could take any piston ring, but no ring with the coating: Chrom !
That mean - Nikasil is a very hard coating, so you could'nt use also any "hard - strong ring coating" !

Nevertheless for your Puma engine we have no information about piston -, liner - and ring material - coating.

Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Kind regards

Peter Gann
MAHLE Aftermarket GmbH
Product Management Engine Systems and Components (MDE)'

There is work around that setback explained on other threads on this forum.
Thank you for your reply.

I already saw that thread about the rings. I wrote down the references from the NPR Europe ones for my reference. Very helpful info. Thanks a lot.

Will check better the wear of the liners asap. But as i don't know the mileage of the car (it has at least 165 000 kms, but may be 265 000) i am affraid that the wear may be a little bit more than just burned oil.

I am still looking for a replacement engine to put in the car while this one is refurbished.
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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

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Post by FastLee » Sat Jan 27, 2018 10:43 pm

Frank wrote:
Wild E. Coyote wrote: That will be the burned oil. Clean it with something soft (a rag!).
Not an angle grinder then?
A hammer .. you need a hammer :lol:

According to Jeremy Clarkson everything can be fixed with a hammer

:D
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1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

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Post by Wild E. Coyote » Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:56 pm

FastLee wrote:

I already saw that thread about the rings. I wrote down the references from the NPR Europe ones for my reference. Very helpful info. Thanks a lot.

Will check better the wear of the liners asap. But as i don't know the mileage of the car (it has at least 165 000 kms, but may be 265 000) i am affraid that the wear may be a little bit more than just burned oil.
Nikasil is extremly hard material and is applied in very thin layer so there is most probably no wear there. If you see the honing marks, bores are OK.

I would go for the first compression ring from Nissan set, the second one from rover set and just reuse the oil scrapper after good clean.

The big end shells are not available from Ford (never were) but there is a get around by using suzuki ones. Check my thread, all the info is there.
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Post by Wild E. Coyote » Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:58 pm

Frank wrote:
Wild E. Coyote wrote: That will be the burned oil. Clean it with something soft (a rag!).
Not an angle grinder then?
I am affraid that might be a slight overkill! But than again, there is that famous Murphy's law: 'don't force it, use a bigger hammer...!'
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Post by FastLee » Mon Jan 29, 2018 4:18 pm

Well. Just looked to the engine block, some of the crossed marks can still be seen on the cylinders. but from one side there is a wear mark near the top. It's a slight mark, but can be felt passing the finger nail.

Will put this engine standing by as i am on the move to get a running engine from UK.

Then, with the car running, i will overhaul this engine top to bottom.
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1998 Ford Puma 1.7 VCT
2002 Volvo S60 T5
1999 Citroen Berlingo Multispace 1.4i

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