Puma Stalling And Not Idling?

[RoadWarrior]

Hi all, finally put my engine back in after an overhaul.

I've put a new lambda sensor in, and checked all the usual suspects, swapped the ICV with a spare one.

It just won't idle whatsoever, the revs drop below 1,000rpms and it stalls out. Even with the clutch in. I've swapped the coil pack with a spare one.

The timing belt was done prior to installation, I followed the blues guide word for word and torqued everything, and rotated the engine twice and checked the timing. I even marked the flywheel when I locked it and the crank and camshafts didn't move a mm.

I'm stumped as to what it can be. The car ran absolutely fine on the engine it had in before, the only thing the same from the last engine is the sensor to the throttle body that sits on the bulkhead, with a little thin pipe going into it, some kind of air sensor I presume.

 

[tuonokid]

Hi
When you did the cambelt did you tension the new belt with the cam pulleys free to move on the camshafts (ie the bolts not fully tightened up) and did you tension the tensioner in two stages ie pull the pin out apprx 2mm, bolt the tensioner up and then fully take out the pin. If not you may want to check the timing again but there is also a check with the tensioner on Gates technical bulletin #036. If you've tensioned it up wrongly there is a photo of how the locking bolt will appear in relation to the slot on the tensioner.
Barry

 

[RoadWarrior]

Yeah, did it step by step of Gates guide. Even with the tensioner. Had the cams undone & put new seals in.

 

[RoadWarrior]

It feels like a fuelling issue to be honest. It kind of lurches as you put the power down.

I've got no temp guage atm and the lead is completely out of the ecu as the pin broke upon relocation for the TAPE ECU :roll:

 

[tuonokid]

Hi
I wish I could give you more clues but usually it's a faulty belt change. If the timing is still spot on it's obviously not that.
Barry

 

[RoadWarrior]

It'll be hard to check the timing now it's all covered up etc, surely? I followed the guide with every step. And rotated the engine by hand about four times and checked it went back to tdc. And it was fine. So I can't understand how it could have jumped timing?

The tensioner was done correctly as Gates suggests as well. Top bolt in, pull pin 2-3mm then put bottom bolt in and torque it then pull pin.

I then torqued all the camshaft bolts and rotated in.

I've removed all of the aircon stuff from it as well and put a Fiesta 1.25 powersteering pump and lines on.

 

[RoadWarrior]

Also further to mention, the oil light isn't iluminating on second click of the ignition. I plugged the little switch in near the thermostat.

 

[tuonokid]

Hi
Yes the only way you can check the timing now is to take off the cam cover so you can get the cam timing tool in. If not for you changing the cambelt prior to running this I would have said idle control valve but you've already swapped that out. Just for your info though if the tensioner hasn't been done up right the engine can run ok for a while until there's something to shock it and then the belt will jump teeth on the sprockets and make the engine run rough.
Barry

 

[Wild E. Coyote]

[post]368487[/post]
I've removed all of the aircon stuff from it as well and put a Fiesta 1.25 powersteering pump and lines on.

Do you have the pressure switch on? That might affect the idling issues as there is no signal. I can't remember on top of my head if the deafult state is open or connected? :?:

Also, I would assume it goes without saying that you have reconnected the crankshaft sensor beneath the starter motor?

 

[RoadWarrior]

Where is the pressure switch? Everything is plugged in minus the abs and aircon as far as I'm aware. Will go over it all and double check. If all else fails remove the rocker cover and check timing a fifth time.

 

[tuonokid]

The pressure switch is screwed into a threaded block on one of the power steering pipes near the front of the engine I think. You can't miss it if you follow the pipes as it's the only thing with an electrical connection on it.

 

[RoadWarrior]

Idle is rough still but no longer have to rev it to keep it going. It's either the MAF or idle control valve. Running a lot better now I've cleaned both with carb cleaner.

 

[RoadWarrior]

How can I check the timing, as I don't have a crankshaft locking pin? I removed the gearbox and pinned it with a flywheel locking tool.

 

[tuonokid]

Hi
I've just noticed that your car is listed as a 1.4 so what I said previously may not be 100% right regarding the cambelt procedure. The full set of timing tools are available from Laser tools at about £12 but depending where you are you may be able to borrow one from someone, I'm near Huddersfield if you want to borrow mine.
PS the pin for the crank isn't a locking pin as it may cause damage if you try to use it as a locking pin.

 

[RoadWarrior]

Hi, it's a 1.7VCT engine.

I'm in Leicester. I have a laser timing set, but the crank one is different to the 1.7 engine. The car has a fault code stored saying camshaft timing advanced on bank 1.

 

[tuonokid]

Hi
Yes it sounds like what I thought as I've had exactly the same on here with someone else and it's usually not setting the tensioner correctly or not tightening the crank pulley to the required setting as the tightness required is extreme. If you're sure you tightened the crank pulley as required you will need to buy a new inlet camshaft pulley stretch bolt and start the tensioning and timing process all over again. Do not drive the car anymore until you've re-done the procedure as it will continue to jump the sprockets until valves meet pistons. If you haven't tightened the crank bolt as per instructions you also need to buy that stretch bolt and tighten it to spec. If you want to talk it over send me a PM with your number and I'll give you a ring.
Barry

 

[RoadWarrior]

It's already done 125 miles of town driving, no clunks etc though. I reused the crank pulley I had, as it was longer than the one supplied in the timing kit.

I've never had a timing belt cause this much effort and problems before. Done a few in the past as well. I'm going to order the tool from Ford to lock the crank to TDC. Will also redo the whole proceedure with a new bolt.

 

[RoadWarrior]

I think what's likely happened is the flywheel locking tool and moved slightly when I've been undoing or tightening the pulley and put the timing out, just ever so slightly. Because I'm 100% confident in the mileage I've done and stopping and starting the engine, the valves will be bent by now and the pistons will have damage. It only takes about three teeths to jump for pistons to meet valves.

But I'm no longer driving it, I'll whip the timing cover off and do the belt in the car this time. No point in dropping it again just to do timing.

Do Ford sell the tensioner on its own? Or is it a new £150 timing kit again?

 

[tuonokid]

If you've re-used the existing crank bolt you need to start from scratch again with a new crank bolt and inlet camshaft bolt as it's just as likely that the crank pulley has slipped on the crankshaft to knock the timing out.

 

[RoadWarrior]

I'll re-do the whole timing job, and buy the pin to check the crank TDC.

Thanks for the help.