Budget Puma TURBO Project!!

[BlackKnight1982]

Is it an old clutch tho?? That's not good tho!
you have got me worrying now!

 

[TyeBoi]

lol lovely! nice to know its rocking out big power!

a RWD puma would be awesome man! speak to erm dave on PP whos recently made a RWD 24v Cossie puma. A lot of custom work though mate.

 

[PumaNoob]

Is it an old clutch tho?? That's not good tho!
you have got me worrying now!

It shouldn't be a worry mate, my clutch on the pumaspeed website is only good for 180bhp, so I expected it to max out eventually!!! It's only a fast rd organic clutch, for use on rd and occasional track use, & I've drove my car like it's on a track with alot more power then was intended! It's a good sign really, it shows that there's alot of power there, and the fact that I've put 17"s on won't have helped anything!! I might just put the 16"s back on to see how much difference it makes!

 

[BlackKnight1982]

Apparently gearbox wise the the early MTX-75 duratec mondeo gearboxs mount upto the zetec engine!! As the straight cut gearset for the IB5 gearbox is only rated to 200bhp!!
I will have to look into what these ST150 lads are running gearbox wise as loads of them are running silly power 250bhp+ on there ST150 with superchargers and they use IB5 gearboxes

 

[PumaNoob]

The problem with the MTX box is the mounts, they are different to the Puma mount, and im not sure if they were hydraulic. Does anyone know if the ST150 box mounts up to the puma engine, and if the mount and linkages are the same? I could imagine that would be a better box, and geared well too

 

[PumaNoob]

I've put my 16" wheels back on,& the slipping clutch seems to have gone away, so I'll leave them on for the moment, as I need to find a good clutch that will take decent power, I've looked into paddle clutches, & they're not very drivable in traffic or everyday driving is awkeward, but I think the problem may be the pressure plate is a standard item, the previous owner probarbly just changed the clutch, it looked standard to me anyway, but I'll need to find something! Also looking at the flywheel, there dosent seem to be alot I could take off it, so I guess that will have to stay for now too! If anyone knows of a clutch kit that takes more then 200bhp, other then a paddle clutch kit, I'd be greatful if you let me know!!

 

[nutty]

Hi
i am pleased you are not putting a paddle clutch in as the are a bitch for every day driving as you said, left leg ends up like arny :grin:

A good valeo or sachs will do 250bhp without any trouble i've tried both clutch's with more power and lived

Paul

 

[PumaNoob]

Thanks for the reply, ive heard nothing but negative comments about paddle clutches, thats why ive decided not to go with it! Ill look into the Valeo and Sach clutches.
Can you, or anyone confirm if the clutch kit from the focus 2.0 and 1.8 silvertop (220mm), escort mk5 , and all the fords that use the IB5 box will fit the Puma??
Im also looking at getting a 1.4 gearbox that should allow me to use my 17" wheels again!

 

[nutty]

If i have you reg will be able to tell you on when ive been to work on monday i will price a valeo for you, why the 1.4 box you will only gain low down torque the 1.4 box still has the same rolling ratio as the 1.7

Paul

 

[PumaNoob]

Why, what do you do, do you wrk somewhere that sells car parts?? The 1.8 focus clutch is a better clutch, its slightly thicker, and 220mm, rather then the 210mm that the std 1.7 clutch is!
Im looking at a 1.4 box rather then 1.7 because when you put 17" wheels on rather then 15" or 16" (the circumference of the outside of the tyre is what determines the torque and power required for each rotation, well leave weight out of it for now), it takes alot more torque to turn a 17" wheel, as 1 rotation of a 17" will go further then a 15" or 16" wheel, as the complete circumference of the tyre is longer. So the more torque of the slightly shorter geared 1.4 box with 17"s, will basically give me the same torque or in the same ball park as the 1.7 box with 16" wheels on, well thats my theory anyway!! Then if i can get the 5th gear out of the 2.0 mondeo box (the ib5 model), i should be able to cruise on the motorway at lower rpm, saving petrol!
An interesting thing i found out was that roughly every 3kg you can take off the flywheel, its like taking 100kg of the weight of the car (as long as its from near the edge of the flywheel, and works different in every gear). Well this theoretically is the same for wheels, putting smaller lighter wheels on is like a major weight saving mod, but not in static weight. This might sound like a bit of a ramble, but t'is true i tell ya!

 

[nutty]

I have been on the tools for 30 years when the recession hit thing were hard for a while and i got a job in telesales for car parts to the trade and the public that what i have been doing for the last 7 months. i have spent all my life around cars building anything that moves. 16 inch and 17 inch should be the same rolling radius give or take 5% with the right tyres
Paul

 

[PumaNoob]

Wow, thats some experience! I think it depends on what size tyres, my 16" have 205 40 16, so 570mm outer diameter, compared to my 17" have 215 40 17, so outside diameter of 604mm. So the 16" circumference will be 1790.94mm, compared to the 17" at 1897.77mm. So an a full rotation, my 17" wheels have gone 106.83mm further. So thats about 6% increase, so id imagine, if the weight was the same, youd need the 1.4 box to be geared 6% lower then the 1.7 box. Im not sure on how much lower it is. Then the actual rotational weight of the bigger wheels, is going to be bigger then the static weight difference, as the further from the centre of the wheel, the more the weight makes a difference. All i know is that with the 17" wheels, my clutch slipped really bad, but now ive put the 16" back on, it feels fine again. Maybe the 6% is all the difference between my clutch maxing out!

If you could get me some info on those clutches mate, that would be a massive help, as there dosent seem to be alot of info readily available, and although my car might not have big bhp, its got loads of torque, and id like to find a clutch that can take at least 250ft/lb, so i know ill be safe, & ready for any other power mods i might add!

 

[nutty]

Pumanoob
Hi looked today, you are looking at £150 for a 3 piece Valeo clutch the standard valeo will handle what you will put through it.


Paul

 

[PumaNoob]

Are you sure?? I'd happily pay £150 for a clutch kit if it can handle the power, but I don't think a standard clutch kit will handle it, I've spoken to techniclutch, and they said my car might be too powerful for their fast rd clutch, because the torque might be in the region of 190+lb/ft. I raced a 230bhp golf the other day & beat him,& was level with a rover 220 turbo, and both those cars unmodified have alot of power, not sure what mods they had, if any, but if my organic clutch can't handle it, why do you think the valeo clutch will cope, are there torque figures that you can access for each clutch?? Thanks for the info, you might have saved me alot of money if this can work!

 

[TyeBoi]

I think mine is wider than yours dude lol.

i will have to check but yeah i think it is.

it has 14mm extra spacing each side from the st170 hubs against disks with the new axle 10mm either side more than the older one. 20mm spacers each side and ET25 wheels.

may need stretched tyres !

 

[Scotty1.7]

Im going with the 1.8 clutch as i can get the full kit- slave, pressure plate and clutch plate for £80 from Romco in Stocport

 

[ScubaSteve]

awesome project,

always a bit dubious about stuff like this mind, for instance you say that owen developments car got 15.6 on the 1/4?

well id be pretty disappointed if id had a turbo conversion done and thats all it managed, my old standard 106gti was running low to mid 15's 1/4's as standard! now that is 120bhp and a little bit lighter then the puma so i wouldnt expect a standard puma to get that, however id want a turbo'd puma to smash it!

i reckon standard pumas are capable of low 16's

 

[Dal]

FRP proven at 15.8s

k:

http://www.projectpuma.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=5603" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[ScubaSteve]

yeah thats about what id expect, and i had a play with an FRP the other day, my engines pretty much standard, and it was really only pulling away above 70, not really any difference to shout home about below 70 so i reckon a 16 or low 16 would be possible in a std 1.7

 

[Neil]

To be honest, I can barely tell the difference between an FRP and a 1.7 for straight line speed. (I've owned both).